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I really have to wonder if Safe Deposit is falling into the same group as the winning apps from MDA. Vaporware......

I really hope not

me too....but after some tantalizing with partial screen shots you completely switch gears and nothing since...seems a little fishy!!!!

Don't worry guys, Safe Deposit is still in development. My development partner has had some personal issues which has slowed development, but I know that you all can understand that him taking care of those takes top priority.

Well, sometimes vaporware materializes suddenly. I don't think anyone still doubts that OmniFocus is coming out eventually. And I really hope that Hijack comes out.

I can understand...but something would be nice...maybe just a little blurp on the site would be good (my opinion)

I think it's a little early to start singing the vaporware song.

EDIT: Spelling.

Vitamin C Power!

OmniFocus was declared Vaporware, and now it's in beta...

Give it time....it's hard to right a nice app quickly...

the greatest blog known to mankind / twitter / flickr

its not hardly time to call vaporware.

duke nukem forever, on the otherhand   is vaporware.

Green Team 4Lyfe

yeah, not vaporware, just another example of why mac (every?) programmers should not open up the development cycle to the audience, or release info before it's further along in the process

My twitter

It won't be vaporware, but updates have been scarce, I agree. But, as Ollie said, there's a good reason.

Back on my two feet

Developers need to choose one of two options:
1. Complete secrecy, no promises or hype until the app is pretty much ready.
2. Complete openness, every delay and milestone is shared (no one has done this yet, but MDA promised to)

1. It was :\
2. A development blog isn't Myspace.

I didn't mean it that way. I don't have a problem with the way you've been doing it. It's hardly been that long of a delay. When things go unexplained for months on end is when I have a problem with it.

I have no doubt it's not vaporware, I'm sure we will something, and I certainly understand personal issues. But, like said earlier, a small blurp once in a while would be nice.

I personally am really excited about seeing a finished product.

According to the official Daring Fireball definition, it is vaporware actually.    Though so was the much-mentioned Omni-Focus for a long time, and the provided definition is relatively neutral rather than loaded with emotion (which is how it is being used in this thread).  For that matter, the MDA apps are all still vaporware also (and so is Whistler ).

Whistle while you work.  Patience is key.

Of course, we all know that Mr. Gruber is the authoritative source on any vocabulary pertaining to technology. Oh wait, isn't that the guy who said both Zune and Apple TV were vaporware?

My question is, what is wrong with a developer announcing his/her product, working on it, and then releasing it when it's ready? I'd much rather wait a year and get a great program than wait three months and use something with bugs and memory leaks. In the case of MDA or Safe Deposit (I don't know much about Omni Focus), let's give these guys a little time to work. We've seen a couple of updates from MDA.

Vitamin C Power!

First sentence - lol (though irrelevant).  Second sentence - doesn't help your point, at the time both were.

Gruber doesn't claim there is "anything wrong" with doing so - he just clearly identifies when that is the case and what the technically correct term is.  In this case, the 'internets' have imbued the term "vaporware" with a lot of emotional charge (DOOM), that isn't necessarily implicit in the technical definition.  Obviously with enough momentum and time the definition can change to fit the usage, and the 'internets' delight in this proof of 'our collective power'.  But I'll stop my rant and get back on target...

I agree completely with giving guys time to work, and wanting a better app rather than a faster app.  That doesn't negate the point that pre-announcing an app before it's done builds certain expectations - that's just the way the game goes, and the risk taken with pre-announcing.  There are benefits too, such as freezing the market (OmniFocus), or building a media frenzy (a la iPhone). 

To make clear my central point: In the case of vaporware, Gruber doesn't provide his own definition - he references several other sources to build his case, and it seems a pretty decent case to me:  http://daringfireball.net/2006/12/omnivapor

Here's an alternate point of view: http://www.roughlydrafted.com/RD/Q4.06/ … 2DD1E.html

Though I found this quote very funny considering my recent studies:
"I've never been an absolute fan of dictionaries. My dad would often use dictionaries to try to prove points that I refused to believe. Unlike math, which I could never prove wrong, I did find ways to take issue with definitions in dictionaries. As I grew up and discovered that dictionaries weren't really magic books, but just written by regular people, I gained new independence from the conformity of thought they tried to impose." 

Heh.  "Gained new independence from the conformity of thought [dictionaries] tried to impose."  If this doesn't typify all that is wrong with popular American thought life these days, I don't know what does.

Back on topic again, my considered opinion is that vaporware is a perfectly legitimate term to use for this software, though loading it with emotion will practically guarantee a fight.  Bluntly, we have no sure way of knowing the software will be delivered and deliver as expected, regardless of intentions or promises or friendship with whichever developer.  This isn't a bad thing, it's just a fact of pre-announcements.  In this case, I don't doubt the software will be released - but I wouldn't put a huge bet down that it would be delivered either.  The future is very unpredictable. 

Whistle while you work.  Patience is key.

The mere fact that its loaded with emotion makes it a bad term to attempt to use technically. It doesn't matter what the definition is if it if everyone reacts to the emotion in the term. Gruber seems to want to tell people their emotional response to the term is wrong, and that he's right to use it how he wants. Conversation doesn't work that way, and using a loaded term makes it harder to have a proper discussion.

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Exactly! I was going to reply with a very similar response but I couldn't have said this better myself.

Of course, if Gruber allowed comments on his DF then discussions like these would happen where they should belong, which is on the DF itself, not scattered all over the Internet...

John Casasanta
MacHeist Director
tap tap tap chief

Yeah. I like when developers pre-announce a product, if it looks like something useful one can get excited about it .

Personally, I'm not one to call a product vaporware unless it is very clearly late. "Vaporware" is a very informal term, you will get a hundred different definitions after talking to a hundred different people. There's not much sense in arguing if a product is vaporware or not, except for the sake of creating an argument (if that is what one desires). It doesn't really matter, the developer will develop or not at his/her own leisure (in most cases).

Vitamin C Power!

....At one point many here would have considered Heist 6 to be vaporware haha

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After further thinking, I'll revise my opinion (since it's sort of contradictory in my statement above anyways ).  Thanks, Wasgo for your response. 

So - not vaporware, pre-announced. 

Whistle while you work.  Patience is key.

It's still pretty boring having that RSS link in my Firefox browser window, and every time I check it there's nothing new anyway. Does feel like one dead app for me..

It's not a dead app... it's an app that's under development and behind closed doors (for now).

Back on my two feet